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Old 08-29-2012, 11:56 PM   #11
CharlieC
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Boy, they sure do lock that thing down... If you have Win 7, you can do full page snips, then drop those into a Word doc if you want to make a print out. Not the most efficient, but it works...

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Old 08-30-2012, 01:32 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mad55chevy View Post
I talked to the full size truck guys and they said that unless you are towing, the cooler ain't necessary.

thanks for helping.
That's really not true towing has nothing to do with steering. Now larger than stock tirers will effect it. The LS1 camaro guys use to have problems with PS pumps as GM didn't have a cooler stock on those. It may be getting hot when turning in town alot or when under the hood heat raises.

For $30 a cooler is a pretty good deal and it will help with PS fluid life as well. Now that is no fix for a bad pump but worth a shot IMO.
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Old 08-30-2012, 07:38 AM   #13
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I feel like I am obligated to step in here as I have a LOT of experience in the fields of P/S, Trans, engine, and overall automotive cooling system design in general.

I used to work for a company that makes P/S coolers for GM, Ford, Chrysler and pretty much anyone else that would buy them. (Long Manufacturing, which is now a division of Dana - these coolers are made in a small plant in Danville, IN - about 30 minutes west of Indy)

I started as a design engineer for them, and spent many summer weeks testing these vehicles throughout the American southwest. (Death Valley, Baker CA, Las Vegas, etc....yeah...life was "rough" those days )
I eventually ended up as their North American sales manager; and therefore it was my responsitility to try to convince these companies that they "needed" to have these coolers on their vehicles.

From my experience I can confidently state that....(2) things drive power steering fluid temperatures up to the point where a cooler is needed, and those (2) things pretty much have to happen at the same time:

They are:

1) High engine rpm (therefore high P/S pump rpm)
2) Constant / high steering input. (ie: lots of steering back and forth)

We'd test trucks towing 18,000 lb going up highway grades for 15 minutes straight near engine redline in first gear (lucky to get 40 mph) and the p/s fluid would NOT heat up to the point that a cooler was needed.

But....if we dropped the trailer and then drove like a madman (high rpm) up a winding mountain road (lots of steering back and forth) the p/s temp would spike very quickly.

Trust me....unless you are taking your car on the track; no one needs a p/s cooler to keep the oil temps down for "normal" driving.
Sorry; but the oil temps just do NOT get up very high with anything that even remotely resembles normal everyday driving.

Now...I will say that adding a cooler (and therefore a small increase in system fluid volume) could theoretically have some other affect on the system; however I certainly wouldn't recommend adding one in order to try to solve any pump issue you are seeing.


I'll also say...FWIW, that the P/S pump in my 2003 Dodge pickup was really whiny recently, and for $50 (Autozone) I swapped in a new pump and it is perfectly quiet now. If you have a whiny pump, I'd just swap it out as you probably have a bad one and/or it's near the end of its life...and they aren't typically that expensive.
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Old 08-30-2012, 08:47 AM   #14
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Mr Handy hit it on the head..........Change the pump..
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Old 08-30-2012, 12:31 PM   #15
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Mr Handy what would you say oil temps would be on a 100* day normal driving. No cooler? And same OAT with a decent fin cooler?



As I have said I agree its not to fix pump problems. To me its more to extend oil life and pump life as the oil would be cooler and thicker. To me that's why OEM's run them as it helps prevent warranty claims on whiny pumps.

BTW anyone else hate the Ford PS whine, everyone I have ever heard sounds the same BAD!! lol
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Old 08-30-2012, 02:11 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BO185 View Post
Mr Handy what would you say oil temps would be on a 100* day normal driving. No cooler? And same OAT with a decent fin cooler?



As I have said I agree its not to fix pump problems. To me its more to extend oil life and pump life as the oil would be cooler and thicker. To me that's why OEM's run them as it helps prevent warranty claims on whiny pumps.

BTW anyone else hate the Ford PS whine, everyone I have ever heard sounds the same BAD!! lol
It's hard to answer a question like that, but I'll say that in general - as long as the P/S temp stays under 230F during 'normal' driving, the OEM manufacturers do not add a cooler.
If one does add a cooler, I would expect it to drop the temp something in the 10-20F range - as long as it has decent airflow across it. (Depends on the cooler of course, but pretty much anything will work for a P/S cooler)

For that hot weather testing I used to do (which was not considered "normal driving") the OEM manufactures would permit short term "excursions" up to 275F or even 290-300F with some manufacturers.
In general though, we'd very rarely see even short term excursions beyond 250F even without a cooler.

You are absolutely right; they add the cooler to prolong fluid life, and therefore indirectly... pump durability.
P/S fluid (which is usually very similar, or the same as trans fluid) has a life span which depends on its "time at temp"; and that is a "exponential" life curve.
ie: at 300F it may degrade to a point that it is garbage in less than 1 hour; however at 275F maybe it will last 10 hours, while at 250 it is good for 100 hours, and 230 it has virtually an indefinite lifespan. (I made up those numbers, but you get the idea)

So if you plan on putting another 200,000 miles on your Tri-5 without changing the P/S fluid.....you might want a cooler!

But other than that.....it's not required.
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Old 08-30-2012, 03:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_handy View Post

So if you plan on putting another 200,000 miles on your Tri-5 without changing the P/S fluid.....you might want a cooler!

But other than that.....it's not required.
Haha so true, I would put 200k on a trifive if I could!
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