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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi,
I have just bought a Borg Warner R10 overdrive transmission for my dad’s 57 Chevy. I opened the overdrive part of the transmission and everything looks great without wear. But the 3 speed part of the transmission is not so good.
My question is if the gears on a standard 3 speed transmission can be used on a 3 speed overdrive transmission.
In this specific case the 1-reverse ring gear is missing a big piece of a tooth and the cluster gear where the ring gear engages for 1 gear is also missing a piece.

I have 2 standard gearboxes of the same year, that have these gears in good condition, but I would not disassemble them if I cannot use the gears anyways.

I hope someone can help me,
Regards, José.
:flag6:
 

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From what I can remember you should be able to use the standard gears , but use the overdrive main shaft and tail housing etc. Don
 

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overdrive

You are in luck, the parts are interchangeable. I would use everything out of the other trans, don't mix and match. To be sure the 3 speed is good I'd install it in the car as is and drive it for a while so you know it doesn't jump out of gear when backing off in second and under power in third. If it checks out OK inspect the needle bearing surfaces in the cluster and the low gear side of the cluster for starting of pitting. Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks so much for your help! In this case what I will do is transfer the gears from the gearbox that is in the car, it is very good. I just want to get more miles per gallon and a quiet engine on the highway.

Best regards, José.
 

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You are in luck, the parts are interchangeable. I would use everything out of the other trans, don't mix and match. To be sure the 3 speed is good I'd install it in the car as is and drive it for a while so you know it doesn't jump out of gear when backing off in second and under power in third. If it checks out OK inspect the needle bearing surfaces in the cluster and the low gear side of the cluster for starting of pitting. Good luck.
Tom, is that a common problem with these Borg Warner boxes??
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Hi Tom,
after reading all kind of info on the net and booklets about this overdrive transmission I still have a question that I cannot find the answer.
When you drive in conventional mode not overdrive with the control handle pulled out, the mechanical system of the overdrive is deactivated. But the electrical system is still on.
So, here is my question…
1.What happens, when I reach the cut-in speed, the governor contacts close and the solenoid gets energized? I assume that the solenoid will set up spring pressure against the pawl, trying to push it into engagement.
2.Doesn’t it damage the solenoid stay energized for a long time without been able to engage and use the hold-in winding alone?
3.Wouldn’t it consume a lot of electricity to stay on the pull winding for a long time?

Best regards, José
 

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Jose, You are correct about the electronics working with the OD handle pulled out. I don't like the stock system so I use a switch instead of a governor(I'm the governor). The solenoid pushes on the pawl but the shift rail that runs from the overdrive to the low/reverse plate keeps the pawl from pressing on the blocker ring. The down side of not using the overdrive(handle pulled out) is that the spring ring around the blocker ring that rotates the blocker ring backwards when you let off the gas and allows the pawl to drop in to the blocker ring, goes around the pawl and wears metal to metal and will eventually wear out. I very seldom pull the handle out unless I'm going down a hill and want to go a little slower than I can in overdrive(2nd or 3rd). I don't think there is any more electricity used one way or the other. It just loads the spring inside the solenoid. I use the overdrive full time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Hi Tom, I have no experience at all with this transmission. I have heard that you can damage the gears if you try to pull the handle out while driving in OD. Is that correct?
What is the right procedure to pull the handle out?

Is there a rule to push the handle in also?
Sorry for so many questions...I do appreciate your help!

Best regards, José
 

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Hi Tom, I have no experience at all with this transmission. I have heard that you can damage the gears if you try to pull the handle out while driving in OD. Is that correct?
What is the right procedure to pull the handle out?

Is there a rule to push the handle in also?
Sorry for so many questions...I do appreciate your help!

Best regards, José
Jose, It is best to stop when you pull out the handle, but you can pull the handle out while rolling if you are not kicked in to overdrive AND you are on the gas so the engine and rearend are synchronized for speed. When the trans is kicked in to overdrive it is mechanically impossible to pull the handle out because the pawl blocks the overdrive shift rail from sliding back. You can push the handle in at any time. The trans will go from the overdrive being locked up to the power loading the sprag, so no rpm change. The handle either locks out the overdrive or just allows the overdrive to be operated but doesn't kick it in.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Hi Tom, thanks so much for the info!!
You told me already that the gears are interchangeable between a 3 speed standard trans and the ones in the 3 speed part of the Overdrive trans.
What about the case? My question is, because I have the overdrive transmission in Denmark and my father lives in Cuba. So, if it was possible to bolt the overdrive unit on to my father’s standard transmission, then I would only need to carry the overdrive main shaft, adapter plate and overdrive unit to Cuba.
It is going to save me a lot of pounds and money! But is it possible to do?

Regards, José
 

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Hi Jose
If you use the 3 speed case there is one hole that you have to drill in the back end of it. You will need to make a template and take mesurements of the OD transmission case. The OD selector rod goes through this hole. I used a 3 speed case with the hole drilled and the tail shaft from an OD transmission with no problems. Also there are also parts in the OD unit that are common with other makes as there are all made by Borg warner.
Ed
 

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The best way to drill the hole in the case is to make a plate that bolts to the 2 bolt holes on the back of the case on either side of the hole for the od shift rail. Then transfer pinch the hole throught the case from the inside, into the plate and drill it out to the size of the original hole in the OD case and you'll have a drill template for the non od case. I did this with a Saginaw 4 speed to convert it to overdrive.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Hi,
I got an old case from a friend to compare with the overdrive unit, and I found a few more differences than the hole for the shift rail. I took a picture and made some edits to show what I mean and be able to ask you my questions.
I have no doubt about hole (1), I will drill it in the standard case as you have told me. Counter shaft (3), I guess I need to push it out a bit, turn it and push it back again, otherwise I will not be able to engage the overdrive adapter.

My main questions are about holes (2) and (4).
Do I need to drill hole (2) in standard case?
Do I need to plug hole (4) in standard case?

I do not know the use of these 2 holes and why they are placed in different areas. My guess is that they have something to do with gear lubrication. Can any of you more experienced people tell me what to do about them.

Thanks in advance,
José
 

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Good observations. The other hole is to facilitate oil flow between the trans and the overdrive and maintain the proper oil level in the overdrive. If the gasket doesn't cover up the lower oil passage hole on the non od case then plug it and drill the upper hole so the fluid level is correct in the od. When you fill the box with gear oil remove the fill plug on the OD and the front case. Fill the overdrive slowly until the gear oil runs out the trans fill plug. The trans case has a lower sump that the overdrive. Check the oil level in the overdrive periodically, as the oil in the overdrive will drain into the case and the overdrive planets will "smear" themselves in the outer ring. Ask me how I know. The rear bushing is susceptible to more wear than the standard because the shaft is short so it isn't as stable, so the rear seal can tend to leak.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hi Tom,
Now I understand the meaning of those holes.
Do you know how many amps fuse I should use for the electrical part?

Thanks a million for your help!!!!!
 

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57 OD

There are folks here who know much more than I about the internal workings of these units. All I can contribute is how my dad and I got these transmissions to work without using the governor or any extra gas pedal linkage or related switch.

I'd be really curious as to how this was mated to a Saginaw 4-speed (which is what is in my car now). Sounds like a nifty set up. Gear Vendors do not have an OD unit for a Saginaw last I checked and they're pricey anyway.

Anyway, here is a link to the page that my post is on. Good luck!

http://www.trifive.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69543&page=2

Ed
 

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The Saginaw 4 speed OD is doable . First you need to locate a Saginaw 3 speed OD. The overdrive section is shorter than the 55-65 chevy overdrive, to maintain the same overall length as the earlier transes and 4 speeds. Then you need to drill the case for the overdrive lock-out rail. The rail extension has to be shortened to accommodate the tab that needs to be welded to the reverse shaft to make the lock-out operate properly. Without this the OD will freewheel in reverse and you would have to pull out the OD handle to be able to back up. The rest is just exchanging the 4 speed gears for the 3 speed gears.
 

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Hi,
I got an old case from a friend to compare with the overdrive unit, and I found a few more differences than the hole for the shift rail. I took a picture and made some edits to show what I mean and be able to ask you my questions.
I have no doubt about hole (1), I will drill it in the standard case as you have told me. Counter shaft (3), I guess I need to push it out a bit, turn it and push it back again, otherwise I will not be able to engage the overdrive adapter.

My main questions are about holes (2) and (4).
Do I need to drill hole (2) in standard case?
Do I need to plug hole (4) in standard case?

I do not know the use of these 2 holes and why they are placed in different areas. My guess is that they have something to do with gear lubrication. Can any of you more experienced people tell me what to do about them.

Thanks in advance,
José
It may just be the perspective of the pictures but it sure looks like the top two mounting holes in the OD case are larger than in the standard.
 
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