Chevy Tri Five Forum banner

1 - 20 of 41 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
145 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I'VE CHECKED THE SPECS. ON THE HELLWIG SWAY BARS FROM ECKLERS AND THE PRO TOURING SWAY BARS FROM PST. THEY'RE BASICALLY THE SAME EXCEPT FOR THE MATERIAL--4140 CHROME MOLY SPRING STEEL, HELLWIG & DOM ALLOY TUBING, PST. DOSE ANYBODY HAVE ANY EXPERIENCE WITH EITHER OR PREFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO? THANKS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
539 Posts
great ?

rockwell hardness makes a BIG Differnace. I would like to know if the chrome molly if harder also.. If its harder then will have greater help in leaning.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
48,747 Posts
BR, i bought my sway bar kit from CCI (now ecklers) many years ago. Can`t remember the manufacturer but it is a 7/8" sway bar. Unless you are going to be road racing it i can`t see where you would need one any bigger or stiffer. Mine holds the road real good now.
Terry
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
539 Posts
the ? is what is stiffer.. a 7/8 can be stiffer ( harder Rockwell) than a 1inch or larger if made with better matteral.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
66,324 Posts
the ones eckler's sells is addco sway bars. they are 7/8's and put them on my 55. there great, $240 for both.
 

Attachments

·
Administrator
Joined
·
48,747 Posts
the ? is what is stiffer.. a 7/8 can be stiffer ( harder Rockwell) than a 1inch or larger if made with better matteral.
My point is, unless you are going to road race or autcross it i don`t think it is going to matter that much.
Terry
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36,144 Posts
The alloy used or the heat treatment of the bar makes absolutely NO difference in how stiff the bar is. Low carbon steel, high carbon steel, and chrome moly steel are all the same stiffness, regardless of their heat treat or hardness.

What does determine the stiffness is the diameter of the bar, and the length of the legs. Bigger diameter = stiffer. Shorter leg = stiffer.

The issue with with strength is whether it will bend or twist permanently within the suspension travel allowed. To keep it from doing that, you need to have the strength of higher alloy, and heat treat. Whether you really need heat treat is a matter of travel.

Now, back to what bar you should have. Any bar is a huge improvement over not having one. But you can definitely tell the difference between a small one and a big one. But there's little difference in ride if any between little and big.

One of the nice things about Hellwig's product line is they offer bigger bars than some of the others, they are one of the few with 1-1/8" front bars. And they brought out a 1-1/4" bar not too long ago.

As far as a rear bar, the stiffer you make the front, the more you need a rear bar to keep balance. Hellwig has also recently brought out adjustable rear bars (the leg length can be changed) that can let you dial in the balance you want. They also have a bar for cars with a pocket kit on the rear springs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
145 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
BOTH HELLWIG AND PST NOW MAKE A KIT WITH 1-1/4" FRONT AND 1" ADJUSTABLE REAR SWAY BARS. HELLWIG'S IS SOLID AND PST'S IS DOM ALLOY TUBING. I'VE BEEN TOLD THAT TUBING IS ACTUALLY BETTER THAN THE SOLID. I APPRECIATE ALL THE INPUT. THANKS
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36,144 Posts
I'm unaware of the tubular PST bars. Are they listed on their website?

PST is not manufacturer, do you know who makes them?

The only advantage of tubular bars is lighter weight. Which can be a big deal with big bars, not so much with little ones.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
166 Posts
I went with the Hellwig 1 1/4 on the front of my 55 and I love it! The handling of my car after install was like driving a totally different car! I do not have one on the rear, and cant really see the need for one.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
145 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
THE " G-MAX " PRO TOURING SWAY BARS ARE IN THE 2010 SUMMER PST CATALOG, PAGE 11. THEY ARE $499-FREE SHIPPING FOR FRONT AND REAR SET. HELWIGS ARE $489. PLUS SHIPPING.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,870 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,621 Posts
In a Super Chevy Magazine test last month on an early (65?) Chevelle, a 1-1/8" front swaybar beat all else tested (on a short timed handling course), both a heavier resistance 1 1/4" bar and a lighter resistance 1" bar. That single front bar also beat out all set ups using a rear sway bar. The expaination was that on a car with factory "soft" front springs it did every thing just right! So....... Bigger isn't always better with swaybars on a fairly "stock" car. Having said that, I have a 7/8" bar, I would upgrade to a "mild" 1-1/8" on a do over.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
762 Posts
the ones eckler's sells is addco sway bars. they are 7/8's and put them on my 55. there great, $240 for both.
Yep, that's what I've got on the '57. I didn't go bigger as I thought it might put too much stress on the A Arms. I've cracked one in the past.

Geoff B
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36,144 Posts
"a 1-1/8" front swaybar beat all else tested (on a short timed handling course), both a heavier resistance 1 1/4" bar and a lighter resistance 1" bar. That single front bar also beat out all set ups using a rear sway bar. The expaination was that on a car with factory "soft" front springs it did every thing just right!"

I'm not sure I really buy into all that, so much is dependent on the tires and tire pressure - and besides it was a Chevelle. So even if true, is it true on a 55-57?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
539 Posts
Sorry but thats not solid info

Simply not true.... You can have a stiffer smaller bar that's Hollow also... Ask the R&D guys about the Rockwell testing at your bar maufactuer if you want to know.... And if thay do not know. Go to the manufatuer that does know.

I do 100% agree on diameter of the bar, and the length of the legs. Bigger diameter = stiffer. Shorter leg = stiffer. On shorter leg stiffer is not always true.

But as far as all metals for sway bars regardless of what there made out of are the same stiffness is simply 100% not true..

On of my 1957 road race SV cars driffting at 116 MPH turn 10 @ sears point....
--------------------------

The alloy used or the heat treatment of the bar makes absolutely NO difference in how stiff the bar is. Low carbon steel, high carbon steel, and chrome moly steel are all the same stiffness, regardless of their heat treat or hardness.

What does determine the stiffness is the diameter of the bar, and the length of the legs. Bigger diameter = stiffer. Shorter leg = stiffer.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
62 Posts
The spring rate of steel is a constant. If two sway bars have the same geometry and the same diameter but one is made from mild steel and one is made from high strength steel, the rate of the sway bar will be the same. The difference in the tensile strength of the material determines how far you can flex the sway bar without deforming or failure due to fatigue.

As far as what works best on a Tri-5. Our 1-1/8" bar is good if you only want to run a front sway bar. The 1-1/4" bar works best with our 1" adjustable rear bar.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36,144 Posts
psb said,

"But as far as all metals for sway bars regardless of what there made out of are the same stiffness is simply 100% not true.."

OK psb, show us some engineering data on that. Be as detailed as you care to. Don't tell us about carbon fiber sway bars or anything like that. You said metals anyway.

Dave, thanks for backing me up.

Simple fact is that sway bars are made from steel alloys. You won't see any others. The stiffness of steel regardless of alloy is the same, only the strength changes with alloy and heat treat. The alloy and heat treat is for strength only.

There is also no doubt that a tubular cross section can be stiffer and stronger per pound. It's advantage or disadvantage is in how it's made for overall strength and how much you have to pay for it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,621 Posts
Dave, I would like to see data on all of your different Hellwig bars tested over a short timed run or even through the cones. All on the same Tri-Five car on the same day on the same track and the same pro driver with the same tires and tire pressure like Super Chevy did on their 1964 Chevelle test. Of course they ended up with no rear bar working the best for a street application. And that may not be good news for a swaybar company to report. :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,465 Posts
In a Super Chevy Magazine test last month on an early (65?) Chevelle, a 1-1/8" front sway bar beat all else tested (on a short timed handling course), both a heavier resistance 1 1/4" bar and a lighter resistance 1" bar. That single front bar also beat out all set ups using a rear sway bar. The explanation was that on a car with factory "soft" front springs it did every thing just right!
Not to dispute any Super Chevy test but doesn't it seem strange that a single front sway bar would outperform a front and rear sway bar?

My common sense tells me, if almost all newer cars and trucks have a front and rear sway bar then there must be something wrong with the Super Chevy test.
 
1 - 20 of 41 Posts
Top