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what years/models for GM, Mustang II, etc front ends?

17K views 30 replies 16 participants last post by  bosses son 
#1 ·
Hi guys, I know this is a repeat question but can't find the info I'm looking for.

I am building a 57' and am trying to find a donor car from the salvage yard for a front end clip.

Can you guys please give me some guidance on what years/models/makes will work? Can be GM or mustang, don't really care. I am ready to start junk yard shopping.

Thanks for your help.
 
#2 ·
Nate some have used the 2nd gen camaro front clips. And i have also heard of the 78-87 chevy pickup frontends being used too, although i believe this one puts the wheels outward quite a bit.
Terry
 
#3 ·
when you see people talking about mustang front ends in the hot rod world they are talking about mustang II ('74-'78). But hold up a minute.. we need to figure out what track width you need.

I had a quick look around, fatman fabrications list your truck as 60.5" track wdith, which is 4" wider than a normal mustang II. They do a kit with the right track width.

There are lots of companies that make and sell aftermarket crossmembers designed to fit the truck, fatman is just one of them. They are mostly designed around mustang II geometry.

You could probably make a crossmember from an actual mustang fit, but it would probably be quite alot of work.

If you are on a tight budget and are confident with a welder there is a company called welder series, they make crossmembers (amongst other things) that are cut out of flat plate, you simply weld it together. I think they are in the $200-300 range for the bare crossmember. Be worth checking if they do one that will fit your truck.

Another option that you may not of considered is a front end from a jaguar - 70s or 80s XJ6. The crossmember actually unbolts from the jaguar and can be welded in to place in the truck, I don't remember the track width but they are quite often used over here (UK) in 50s trucks.


Camaro clips - not absolutely sure but I think its 2nd gen camaro.
 
#4 ·
There are so many options here.

You have the GM clip, volare, aftermarket clips are endless from the Mustang 2 to the corvette.

If you want my opinion about a donor car my first choice would be a GM g-body 78-88 Monte Carlo, Cutless, Regal etc. The track with is more to my liking.

My 2nd choice would be a 2nd Gen Camaro or Firebird. These clips are great I just like the track width on the g-body clips a little better. The g-body's track with are a little narrower.
 
#5 ·
I wouldn't touch one of those junk Mustang 2 suspensions for anything. JMHO.

I would also consider the C4 Corvette setup. It's a modular piece with the front crossmember doing the locating of the suspension components. Take a look in my Picturetrail albums.

Where are you in Colorado?
 
#9 ·
I've heard folks say this before but never had anyone give a good reason. Could you explain why you think the mustang II or an aftermarket vendor (I assume) isn't something to consdier. There are many professionals who seem to use these with great results....why do you think they are not worth considering?
 
#7 ·
cut as far back as you can get, I'd go for just in front of the first body mount - usually by the firewall, that way when fitting it to the truck chassis you can pick where you join them.
Make sure you somehow have joiner or boxing plates when you join the two chassis.
Before you cut the clip off the donor weld a piece of angle iron across the frame rails so that it doesn't move once you've cut it off. If you can't weld it then I guess nut & bolt something across - better than nothing.

I think your best option is a camaro clip from what you say. I agree with chevynut I wouldn't use a junkyard mustang clip - by the time you cut it out, make it fit, replace all the bushes, but the 11" rotors, aybe dropped spindles you won't have saved anything.

Far as steering goes the camaros use a steering box, so yes get that. I'm not too up on how the columns are coupled to the boxes in those cars, be worth doing a little research to find out.

Speak to Chevynut nicely he might do you a good price on a corvette front end, which would be pretty trick in your truck :)
 
#12 ·
The Mustang II is a light car, fairly narrow track width. So it's most appropriate for transplanting into a car like that. A 50s truck isn't one of those. They are more right for 30-40s cars and trucks, which are lighter and narrower. Even then, aftermarket parts will be easier to use and offer you upgrades that aren't there with a transplant.

On the other hand, if you get pieces from an aftermarket supplier, the width problem will be solved, as well as many other little things. For one thing, you will need to upgrade the brakes from the stock Mustang II stuff.

If you want to go with a salvage yard clip, I think the 2nd gen Camaro is more appropriate.
 
#16 · (Edited)
I think it all depends on what your going to do with your truck. If you're just going to drive it, any of the car frontends should work fine. I want to use mine to tow or whatever so I set my truck on the 73-87 half ton frame. I think it was Terry that mentioned the track is a little wide, and it is, about an inch a side. If I leave it sitting up stock height I think it will look ok, but If I go to lowering it the only option is to narrow the A-Arms. Good to see another truck guy, show us some pics and keep us posted.
 

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#18 ·
I thought we were talking about a stock MII front suspension. I don't know what the aftermarket ones are based on or how they are different.

What makes these "Mustang II" suspensions when they use aftermarket crossmembers, a-arms, spindles, etc.???? Is there something particular about the MII design?

Heidt's makes some nice stuff. ;)
 
#19 ·
The Mustang II frontend is just easily adaptible to about any application. Most of the aftermarket MII frontends are an improved version of the original design. The rack and pinion steering is what made it so popular to use, with no steering box needed and it's easy to change from front to rear steer.
 
#20 · (Edited)
Good and simple explaination (I understood this to be the case as well).

I was under the impression that the discussion was more focused on the aftermarket stuff, but from reading the initial posts again, I guess I was off track.
For the record and I guess it requires clarification, I personnally was never considering finding an old Mustang II and using the front end. And I wouldn't want to do that kind of engineering/fabrication with a stock Mustang II front end, seems others have used other clips with better success.

For my application, I am researching using one of the Heidts, Fatmain, Scotts Hot Rod or other comparable IFS designs with the weld in cross member and coil over shocks that is based on the Mustang II spindles, A-arms. Just trying to get a feel for who has used what.....
 
#21 · (Edited)
I agree about the stock Mustang II I would not do it either. If cash is an issue you could buy the after market mustang 2 crossmember and buy the other components separate. That's what I did. I have a TCI Mustang 2 crossmember, Heidts upper and lower a-arms, Heidts coil over shocks, t-bird rack and 11 inch rotors on my truck and I like it. If I had to do it again I will have saved a little extra cash and did the Heidts Superride, Scotts IFS, Flatout Engineering corvette etc. I like the way the upper a-arms are on those units in my opinion just a better design but you pay for that.lol I have used and installed Mustang II, Camaro, Volare, Monte Carlo units on these trucks in the past and been happy with the results. Its all in what you want and your skill level. The easiest by far is the aftermarket units, then the volare, the hardest is the GM clip. Once again I prefer the Monte Carlo to the Camaro clip, but either one you will be happy.
 
#22 ·
The aftermarket stuff is typically based around mustang II geometry - camber, caster (castor?), anti dive etc.

You could use a aftermarket crossmember with stock a-arms, spindles etc. Most kits are now supplied with 11" disc brakes (stock mustangII had much smaller discs). The calipers with the kits are a GM design I think ? You can get Wilwood upgrades to nice 4 pot calipers etc.

So, these crossmembers are heavily mustangII based, both in design and the parts used.

These sort of kits are available from fatman fabrication, total cost involved, chassis engineering and many others.

Heidts and Scotts (amongst others) are kind of one step on really, they make and sell crossmembers that don't have interchangeable parts with mustangII, typically they are somewhat more elegant, especially where the top a-arm and shock mounts are, this allows it to use coilover shocks or the combined airbag/shock units easily. I believe they are roughly based on the mustangII geometry though.

If you want to see some funky stuff have a look at Kugel Komponents website, they do stuff with cantilever shocks etc.. they can give a very clean look..

Ok, so some pictures..

Heidts "MustangII" suspension



Heidts own "Superide" suspension


Kugel Komponents "Indy Style" suspension
 
#27 ·
My 57 has the g-body cross member and steering components - not clipped but sectioned in with the frame rails dovetailed and boxed and the front stock for a no mod mounting of the radiator support. I don't know who did it (was there as I bought the truck and I am the third owner post resto) - but the work is real good, and the track matches the caddilac 8.5 inch rear with discs. This does limit my tire size to 70's though as they are already precariously close to the fender at the top and I can see that moving the wheel back with backspacing would then have frame interferance. I do like the turning radius, steering response and all the steering parts are easy to find and replace (78 Monte)
 
#28 ·
stck mustang crossmember made to fit

Newbie here I just got a smokin deal (or so I think) on a 57 PU somone lost interest in. they used a mustang 2- newer pinto modified the stock crosmember to fit the pick up looks like they did a nice job but the tie rods where short so they used a sleve to extend them (ugly).I here that thinderbird (80's) tierod end might ?? fix this sence they are longer? they rebult the front end with new ball joints ,bushings and new 5 hole rotors thats where they stoped I got the truck and lots of parts for 500$ so I was happy Is there anything I should look at or worry about with the conversion?
anyone used -modified a mustang crosmember?
got my work cut out for me but the frame seams close to done with a 9 inch rear frame blasted and painted w/por15 was REALY disasembled though.
Hope I did not drag home more scrap metal as a gear head I do that lol .

Joel
 
#29 ·
most all aftermarket kits are made the same except fatmans . they are plate welded together which in time will fatigue and crack . i am replacing the front frame on a 37 ford now . had the aftermarket kit in it. tore the strut rods mounts out of the frame , cracked at lower aframe mounts. i refuse to install them anymore. this is the 4th one i have repaired. fatmans uses thick wall tubing to build the xmember and is what i use to repair with.
i prefer the camaro clip . easiest and safest install. i use the entire clip setting under the stock frame. geometry does not change . tire clearance can be corrected by using a 1 in spacer under the forward cab mount. allows for up to 225/65 tires. the tires on this truck never hit .
 

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#30 ·
A friend of mine has a '56 F series big window PU and he installed a Fatman frontend end under it when he built the truck about 8yrs ago. That truck drives/handles like a dream...I came darn close to buying it from him a couple years ago.
 
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