Does anyone have a recommendation for a good steering box grease. I think
it's 90 weight oil days are over.
Thanks in advance.
Don
it's 90 weight oil days are over.
Thanks in advance.
Don
Steering Box Grease?
Don Thompson
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I just did the following conversion listed here ==> http://www.carnut.com/specs/steering/pwr605.html I read way too much on steering box rebuilds and what I read said do not just pack the box with grease, because it just sits there. Another piece I read said that the grease should be more of a paste consistency.. Given that information, what I did was mix some marine application grease (water resistance) with some BlendzAll 2 stroke oil ==> http://www.blendzall.com/ (Blendzall is known for sticking to metal parts being 2 stroke oil). It mixed very good together. I mixed some in the little plastic ketchup cups, and used an acid brush to coat the gear teeth liberally, then I poured some extra into the box before closing it up. If you ever open up an old box that was packed with grease, you will see, it is just sitting there, no use whatsoever. You can also contact these guys, they seem to know everything steering ==> http://midweststeering.com/ If you go with a zerk, as I did as well, these little plugs from Grainger ===> http://www.grainger.com/search?nls=1&searchQuery=grease+fitting+cap are pretty neat little goodies, they come 10 to a pack. If you are near a Grainger location, you can order on the website and pick up your order at a local store, avoiding shipping charges. Grainger is a unique resource for things you do not normally see...Hope this helps.
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I am not understanding this thread. Why do you want to install grease into a recirculating ball system. You inject the grease, is everything covered? If it was good, wouldn't the engineers at Saginaw have specified wheel bearing grease? Grease can harden with age. The lithium soap complex is not the lubricant, it is only a vehicle used to suspend oil for lubrication and be compatible with oil and surrounding metals. It's purpose is to lubricate where submersion in a lubricant is not possible. If I am being redundant, Sorry.
If the only criteria is to stop a leak, why not fix the leak? You have a classic car, why not give it a classy repair? These cars are not complex as are present day EPA, NHTSA, ISO compliant cars.
Reminds me of the old adage, "if your friends jump off a bridge.....
I mean no offense to anyone. I just like to fix things correctly, anything borderline of shade tree does rest well with me.
If the only criteria is to stop a leak, why not fix the leak? You have a classic car, why not give it a classy repair? These cars are not complex as are present day EPA, NHTSA, ISO compliant cars.
Reminds me of the old adage, "if your friends jump off a bridge.....
I mean no offense to anyone. I just like to fix things correctly, anything borderline of shade tree does rest well with me.
Well they did, with a service bulletin, I believe in late 1956.
Think about it, grease is better than no lube at all, which is what you have if you have a leaky sector shaft seal. And if you inject a little new grease occasionally, you're likely to be OK.
Just guessing, I'd say 80-90% of the original steering boxes that are still serviceable today have grease in them, not oil.
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Rick,
All I can say to that is, please show me the bulletin.
All I can say to that is, please show me the bulletin.
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The corporation issued bulletins to "fix" an issue after production to satisfy warranty. Not all bulletins were bullet proof repairs, just a fix. Off topic is the bulletin issued by Mitsubishi on the Dodge Challenger/Plymouth Saporo. My daughter purchased an '82 with her inheritance. The cam plug fell out in the driveway and because she had an oil gauge and she was young and not aware that a red light means something is wrong, the oil was pumped out the valve cover and the engine blew up, #1 rod punched a hole through the block. I later found out that Dodge put out a bulletin on the cam plug, I even possess a copy. The fix was to build up a dam of glue or silicone to prevent the seal (hockey puck hunk of round rubber) from popping out the back of the valve cover. This is an overhead cam engine, the MCA Jet. This is a fix for lack of a properly machined valve cover and head to contain the seal. For the most part, bulletins are quick fixes, not a proper repair. Recalls were not part of the 50's. Some bulletins probably recommended sound and permanent repairs, still it was to get the vehicle past the warranty period or the production run.
I think that you are correct.
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Sorry to open any wounds.
I have been thinking about this since posting. Yes, I have now seen the bulletin and I must remark that the info is lacking a bit, to say the least. First, the publication is January of 1957. That is less than half way through the production period of 1957. If the issue was that critical, wouldn't the steering boxes have been changed over in December of the previous year or January 1957? Can anyone tell me for fact that the factory stopped using oil and installed a zerk fitting on a steering box? I don't think so. Second, there is a disclaimer about the availability of the oil lubricant - stating, if available, continue to use it. Third, there are no reasons given nor are there any directions on how to do the change over to chassis lubricant. Fourth, I have never witnessed any oil recommendation chart that has specified chassis lubricant for a tri-five Chevy steering box. Fifth, why was the oil not available?
This raises a lot of questions and if anyone has the answers without assuming, I would like to hear them and be educated. My 56 has the original box, has yet to leak, and is manual steering. For those that want to take the quick route and install a zerk fitting, go for it. I doubt it to be a superior repair - the seal or the sector shaft is still worn.
I have been thinking about this since posting. Yes, I have now seen the bulletin and I must remark that the info is lacking a bit, to say the least. First, the publication is January of 1957. That is less than half way through the production period of 1957. If the issue was that critical, wouldn't the steering boxes have been changed over in December of the previous year or January 1957? Can anyone tell me for fact that the factory stopped using oil and installed a zerk fitting on a steering box? I don't think so. Second, there is a disclaimer about the availability of the oil lubricant - stating, if available, continue to use it. Third, there are no reasons given nor are there any directions on how to do the change over to chassis lubricant. Fourth, I have never witnessed any oil recommendation chart that has specified chassis lubricant for a tri-five Chevy steering box. Fifth, why was the oil not available?
This raises a lot of questions and if anyone has the answers without assuming, I would like to hear them and be educated. My 56 has the original box, has yet to leak, and is manual steering. For those that want to take the quick route and install a zerk fitting, go for it. I doubt it to be a superior repair - the seal or the sector shaft is still worn.
I think you are making this too difficult.
Yes, oil may be better than grease, but IMO grease is good enough. After all this isn't a high speed, highly stressed piece of equipment.
Think about the following.
How many steering boxes have worn prematurely and had to be replaced because they had grease in them? Probably very few. At the worst, it's unknown.
How many steering boxes are still in good shape today because they had grease in them? I say quite a few.
How many steering boxes are absolute junk because they had NO lube in them? Many.
Yes, oil may be better than grease, but IMO grease is good enough. After all this isn't a high speed, highly stressed piece of equipment.
Think about the following.
How many steering boxes have worn prematurely and had to be replaced because they had grease in them? Probably very few. At the worst, it's unknown.
How many steering boxes are still in good shape today because they had grease in them? I say quite a few.
How many steering boxes are absolute junk because they had NO lube in them? Many.
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I am not one that believes in that adage that "good enough" is sufficient, especially if I spend thousands of dollars restoring something. That attitude allows airplanes to fall from the sky. Overkill? Mecum Auction? Jay Leno?
No, a steering box is not subjected to high speed rotation but, it is a stressed piece of equipment. Put some radial tires of the front of a tri-five with manual steering using 235-70R15 and tell me you are not stressed in turning the wheel while the car is sitting still. This is why power steering is so popular today. The 18" steering wheel is passe, the trend is 15" carried over from the advanced engineering of newer, smaller cars. Bias-ply tires are easier to turn but, they require the toe-in specs to be positive and this puts stress on the steering box. Radial tires are usually set at zero toe in/out due to better tracking. Just making comparisons for understanding. The road does transmit a lot of shock to the steering box and that can induce wear.
To answer your first question, I have no clue. I seriously doubt many contained chassis lubricant. How many steering boxes have you seen on a tri-five with a zerk fitting that was installed in 1957 by a dealership? How about one from 1962?
To answer your second question, again I have not data. Gut feeling, not many as I feel it was not the norm.
To answer your third question, I would say every one of them.
From experience, dealerships and gas stations want to make profits. When a car comes in for an oil change, there is/has been a checklist and the steering is on that list, even back in the day. Mechanics were instructed to look for the pipe plug or similar plug for manual steering and the cap/dipstick for power steering. Any extra products added during the oil change increase profits - same as today. Now consider the home mechanic the DIY guy (do it yourself), he takes pride in his purchase. He would check fluid levels.
The bulletin offers limited knowledge about a leakage problem and when you add to it that it still recommends use of the oil, if available, to accept the change to chassis lube just raises questions.
Why not just replace the seal. At least it is only one. Later power steering boxes utilized two aka the Mopar boxes I have experienced.I did a few and do not remember every brand. All are easy to replace. If the sector shaft is worn, either replace it or weld and machine it back to specs. If you have other leaks, maybe it is time for a complete rebuild.
Unless someone comes up with a positive reason to go from gear oil to chassis lubricant in a recirculating ball steering box, I am not convinced this bulletin was a mandate for all tri-fives and exists as an after thought from corporate to get out of a customer issue.
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Look, it's your car so you will go in the direction you will go. You have read the opinions and seen the paperwork. For nearly 60 years owners have been using grease in the steering box. Some used oil. I myself would never use oil because for the near 40 years I have owned my 57, I have used grease and the stock, original to the car steering box works perfectly and still has the original factory seal. For me, easy is good. If you do decide to use oil, keep us posted as to the oil product you use and your experience with using the oil which will be helpful to others who are deciding which way to go. You may end up being very right!
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So, it is not possible to stop the leak with a new seal???????
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Pretty well says it all. :congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::congrats::gba:
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At least for all the shade tree mechanics out there
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No horse in this race, don't know. Grease worked well for me before upgrading to the CCP500 Box. ONLY time will tell, please post your results. :shakehands::shakehands::shakehands::anim_25: With help from this site, Proud to be called a shade tree mechanic. Thank You Lloyd
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I am open-minded. In fact, so open there are holes in it. My point is - Why push grease into a mechanical unit when the manufacturer specifies a mineral oil and an oil leak can be repaired with a seal. I have read the bulletin, I have heard the opinions, I have read the forum testimony, and I am a synthetic user and despise mineral oil. No one has come up with a valid reason why the factory bulletin was published, the stipulations, the instructions the factory provided, etc. It mentions a leak, instructing to change over to chassis lubricant with no specifics. Near the end of the bulletin, is also states that if the oil is available, continue to use it.
GM Heritage Center had no information on this until I forwarded the bulletin link form Jalapeno.
If the oil was bad and causing leaks, why would it be recommended to continue it's usage?
What parameters were used for this changeover?
Where are the instructions?
I do not care if you use grease in your personal steering box, I am seeking information before I can or would justify the reason for a changeover. To date, testimony and opinions. I just do not believe everything I read, especially from a profit oriented corporation that will do most anything to reduce costs. Warranty is a huge cost. There is only one warranty from the manufacturer. If you have a repair done under warranty, your warranty is not extended, you are covered for the original period, mileage and time. This is where I have a real issue with this bulletin.
GM Heritage Center had no information on this until I forwarded the bulletin link form Jalapeno.
If the oil was bad and causing leaks, why would it be recommended to continue it's usage?
What parameters were used for this changeover?
Where are the instructions?
I do not care if you use grease in your personal steering box, I am seeking information before I can or would justify the reason for a changeover. To date, testimony and opinions. I just do not believe everything I read, especially from a profit oriented corporation that will do most anything to reduce costs. Warranty is a huge cost. There is only one warranty from the manufacturer. If you have a repair done under warranty, your warranty is not extended, you are covered for the original period, mileage and time. This is where I have a real issue with this bulletin.
Mine leaked where the steering column goes into the box. I've never had my steering box out. How easy is it to replace that seal?
And it's funny because just yesterday I was thinking about this thread and I was going to mention that I think my headers heat my steering box enough to allow the grease to flow where it needs to go.
And it's funny because just yesterday I was thinking about this thread and I was going to mention that I think my headers heat my steering box enough to allow the grease to flow where it needs to go.
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